Talk:The Cage (episode)
Episode talk page Maintenance links __TOC__ Cage vs Menagerie? here's a question, since the cage has a different ending than the menagerie, can the cage as a whole, and all the scenes that were cut from the menagerie still be considered canon? :I don't really see how it can be considered to have a different ending -- nothing about the way "The Cage" ended was different from how the events were depicted as ending in "The Menagerie" -- they just omitted the mention that Vina was able to have her own illusory Pike after Pike and the Enterprise left in 2254. Everything else was the same, just edited for brevity. -- Captain Mike K. Barteltalk 14:32, 19 May 2005 (UTC) ::The ending of "The Cage" has a Vina with illusionary health walking off with an illusionary Pike. The ending of "Menagerie" has a Vina illusionary health walking off with the real Pike with illusionary health. --Myko 16:23, 19 May 2005 (UTC) :::yes, but that is an addition, not a change -- the Menagerie simply skips the part where, in the past, Vina meets the illusory Pike. I still consider it canon, its been released in its entirety as the original version. The Cage: # The Talosians give Vina an illusory Pike. # Pike leaves The Menagerie # The scene where Vina meets the illusory Pike is omitted # Pike leaves # Addition Pike returns years later and is given an illusory body. The "real" Pike and Vina meet, in stock footage reused from the omitted scene. I don't see how Pike returning and walking through the same door with Vina contradicts the possibility that an illusory Pike existed -- it simply isnt addressed (not contradicted) by the later adaptation. -- Captain Mike K. Barteltalk :The contradiction lies in the way the stock footage is used. Some might feel it's a contradiction, others do not. --Myko 18:29, 19 May 2005 (UTC) ::Well do those folks also feel that the Enterprise only visited five planets in TOS? After all, if you say that stock footage is immutable, then Delta Vega is the same planet as M-113, the same planet as Ardana, the same planet as etc.. ::Those who are sensible realize the stock footage represents a different occaosion of a similar thing happening.. -- Captain M.K.B. 14:55, 6 April 2006 (UTC) So, you're saying that canon should be that the Talosians provided Vina with an illusory Pike as the Enterprise first left, then 13 years later, they provided her with the real Pike... and they walked up the same rock the exact same way? --Proudhug 14:12, 27 November 2007 (UTC) :As the person above just stated, if you're going to be that anal about it, then every single planet that reused the same soundstage or the same Vasquez Rocks in California was "canonically" the same planet, and the crew were actually just deluded madmen thinking they were visiting a bunch of different worlds. Gregly 20:58, 22 January 2008 (UTC) The Cage airdate We all know that The Cage was "Unaired in initial broadcast run", but it did get broadcast at some point. But when? How could we find out? Would it have aired during the run of TNG? Possibly during the second season with it's strikes etc? I think it aired in the UK for the first time on the 13th of May 1992. Igotbit 15:44, 22 January 2006 (UTC) :Earlier today, an anon user changed the airdate from to . The original episode was aired at the same time as The Star Trek Saga: From One Generation To The Next. As it happens, this was originally aired on 4 October, but some markets delayed it until 15 October. As such, I've reset the airdates to the original ones. -- sulfur 16:13, 12 November 2008 (UTC) Transcripts in disagreement Spock's wording when Talosian's are taking information from the ship's computers is different in several online transcripts. Is it "this fly", "this file", or as I hear it, "the supply" (as in a 60's computer term corresponding to today's term "memory")? Curious. --204.97.183.31 19:05, 12 September 2007 (UTC) Nitpick I removed the following nitpick as per the discussion on Ten Forward. :The Talosians apparently have enough medical knowledge to repair Vina's injuries and save her life. The Talosians are also humanoid (with some differences, obviously) and have enough mental ability to read Vina's thoughts. Vina also was travelling with a group of scientists when the crash of the ''Columbia took place. Shouldn't sufficient anatomical knowledge be available to prevent -- or at least greatly reduce -- Vina's disfigurement? Or have the Talosians lost more than their mechanical abilities living old memories and thoughts?TXPAScot 14:15, 24 February 2006 (UTC)'' The Cage Airdate (from ) It has been well documented that the original pilot The Cage did not air in the original run of The Original Series, but it did air at some point. Possibly during TNG's first/second season troubled period. Is there a way of finding out when The Cage was shown on US TV? Igotbit 20:19, 3 March 2006 (UTC) :"The Cage" was aired for the first time in its entirety and in full color in 1988 as part of The Star Trek Saga: From One Generation to the Next. Aholland 04:20, 6 March 2006 (UTC) :That's a great start, but does anyone know the airdate for The Star Trek Saga: From One Generation to the Next? It's not on IMDB & I did a Google search for it but found next to nothing. It doesn't help that the word Saga is so oftn applied to Star Trek and Jonathan Frakes hosted a documentary called: Journey's End: The Saga of the Next Generation. If it jogs the memory The Star Trek Saga: From One Generation to the Next was presented by Patrick Stewart Igotbit 18:40, 10 March 2006 (UTC) ::The first air date was October 4, 1988. See http://www.craveonline.com/print.php?sid=689. Aholland 02:28, 23 March 2006 (UTC) :::I've seen "The Star Trek Saga: From One Generation to the Next" in circa 1997 and recorded it on VHS, but I don't know where I put it... I've last seen it 4 or 5 years ago. It's not a great documentary, aside from presenting "The Cage" in it's full original format it is quite short and hasn't got too much interesting stuff. But there's one mystery I did not find the answer since then: why is DeForest Kelley and all his contributions to ST ommitted from it? Even in a scene from ST: TMP they show a pan and scan version only showing Kirk and Spock while in the full widescreen version McCoy is also present. Anyone knows the answer?? I clearly remember watching this documentary my Freshman year of college. It aired just before Season 2 of TNG started. I remember hearing about Star Trek V, Ten Forward, and Guinan for the first time in that special. When the Cage started there was an introduction by GR, the very same introduction that is on the TOS Season 3 DVD. ::I suspect it's probably because the special documentary was little more than a wrap-around to fill out the two hours they had slotted out to air "The Cage" in. It was a very brief (in comparison to others) documentary, basically just hitting the main highlights of the original series run and first four movies. Then after "The Cage," a VERY brief look at Star Trek V and then talk about the first season of TNG with a small preview of season two. If memory serves, the special aired sometime in September, around the time the season would have started if not for the writer's strike, which pushed the season back to late November. – leandar 19:23, 12 September 2007 (UTC) IMDb states on this page: http://imdb.com/title/tt0059753/releaseinfo that it premiered on US video in 1986 and aired on US television in September 1988. Unfortunately no exact date is given for either. – Ds093 20:17, 12 September 2007 (UTC) Leonard Mudie's age It is stated on this page that Leonard Mudie was, at 85, the oldest actor ever to appear on TOS. It's just, he wasn't 85. His year of birth is given as 1883 - thus he would have been 81 at the time the scene with him in it was shot. It seems that someone got his or her arithmetics wrong here! :D --Maxl 10:56, 15 June 2006 (UTC) Extra data This little bit was left in the page source by DYKbot when the new episode sidebar templates were introduced. They represent extra data in the old table that didn't have a known place in the new tamplate. So what are we going to do with it? And what does an exact date for "pilot story outline" mean anyway? What is the source of this information? --Bp 01:52, 18 October 2006 (UTC) I'm not the originator of the sidebar you mentioned, but to answer your question: the date is simply the date that GR typed on the outline he submitted. It is usually the date one finishes and submits a work. The date comes from "The Making of Star Trek" by Stephen E. Whitfield. Sir Rhosis 19:26, 11 November 2006 (UTC) Nimbus what's the reference to Nimbus 1 in this episode? is it the first planet in the Nimbus system? - User:142.162.48.37 :See here - Philoust123 15:51, 26 November 2006 (UTC) ::Yeah, or just see the article you linked to yourself... :) -- Cid Highwind 16:21, 26 November 2006 (UTC) Green Orion Make-up Tests Hasn't it been conclusively established (specifically in "Inside Star Trek" by Solow and Justman) that it was Majel Barrett who got painted green for the make-up tests, only to have them continually be "corrected" by the film processing lab? I'm not going to revert it until I read the book again, but perhaps someone with a copy could do so. There are numerous stills of Barrett in the Orion green make-up. Why else would she be wearing it? Sir Rhosis 22:16, 21 January 2007 (UTC) Justman tells the story of the Barrett color test in one of the extras in one of the TOS DVDs. I've seen a lot of "is it true" on this site, when the confirmation is told by one of the participants in the DVD extras. Are you guys not paying attention? It doesn't say there are no ship's phasers or photon torpedos A trivia entry says that "The Cage" is in canon violation to "Enterprise," (or vice-versa) because in "The Cage" they have to take a portable laser weapon down to Talos to fire at the knoll instead of firing from the ship. I don't recall any specific dialogue that established the portable unit was the only ship's defense. Perhaps they simply chose to take it down and set it up thirty feet away to get better pinpoint aiming accuracy. IMHO, the entry is shaky at best and should be removed. Sir Rhosis 20:06, 8 February 2007 (UTC) :Away it goes :) --OuroborosCobra talk 21:15, 8 February 2007 (UTC) Removed POV Removed opinionated POV. --From Andoria with Love 11:34, 10 September 2007 (UTC) :* Although this episode is often lauded for its depiction of Majel Barret's character of Number One as a strong willed, capable woman as second in command of the Enterprise, it should be noted that the complete version of the episode contains Pike's reference to his discomfort with having women on the bridge (complete with an insulted reaction from Number One and Pike's half-hearted attempt to cover up his faux pas). Considering the presentation of women as highly capable, equal members of society in virtually all subsequent Star Trek programs (including Star Trek: Enterprise, which precedes this story chronologically by over a century), this short sequence is painfully reflective of chauvinistic, 1960's attitudes. Thankfully, this dialogue was not re-featured in The Menagerie. the true release date It says here that The Cage was originally released on VHS in November 1986. If this is so, then November 1986 is the true release date of The Cage. I can't find a source for this. I can't find this supposed VHS on eBay or Amazon.com or anywhere else.